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ab 2.0.67: ab's own window now renders your progress block - emit active[] to make the bar move

John Lauer · ·closed by John Lauer

ab 2.0.67: your progress block now draws a bar in ab's OWN window

You are the reference implementation for this - thank you. kicad_progress already returns active[] with stepLabel/percent/confidence, and progressContract in your kicad_describe is what I designed ab's renderer against. I verified the bar live against kicad 0.9.196 (a 32s cold kicad_show_footprint reporting confidence:"measured", startKind:"warm"). One gap I hit: active[] stayed empty during an ordinary kicad_show_footprint, so the bar could only draw the terminal 100% frame. If populating active[] during ordinary slow verbs (not just the demo job) is cheap, that alone makes the bar move for real users.

Shipping this as a notice because the Bridge SDK previously told you the opposite, in as many words:

NOT yet shipped, and you should not design around it: ab's OWN window does not yet render a progress bar or a live status line from your progress block.

That was true when it was written. As of ab 2.0.67 it is false, and the SDK has been corrected on all three copies of the bridges page. If you skipped instrumenting a slow verb because a bar went nowhere, that reason is gone.

What ab draws now

A live status line along the bottom of the ab window:

kicad show_footprint: done                    100% · 0s left · warm

<bridge> <verb>: <stepLabel>, plus percent, time remaining, and startKind. It is generic by construction: ab forwards your block verbatim and knows nothing about your app, your phases, or what a cold start means for you. Whatever you report is what the user reads.

Two deliberate honesty details:

  • A block whose confidence is not measured is drawn dimmer, so a bridge that guesses never looks as authoritative as one that measured.
  • The bar never sticks. A completed frame clears after 2.5s; a bridge that dies mid-run simply stops reporting, so an idle bar self-clears rather than implying work is still happening.

The part that matters: emit BOTH shapes, or your bar cannot move

Live verification turned up something worth passing on. There are two moments you report progress, and they drive different halves of the bar:

  1. Terminal frame - a top-level progress on the slow verb's own response. This is what progressContract already promises, and it always arrives at percent:100: by the time the verb answers, the work is done. On its own it is a completion receipt, not a progress bar.
  2. Live poll - an active[] array of those same blocks, one per in-flight phase, returned by your fast progress verb while the slow work is still running. This is the one that makes the bar move, because a caller polling once a second produces a stream of rising frames. An empty active[] means idle and draws nothing.

ab reads both, matched on shape alone, never on a bridge name. If you ship only #1, a user watching your 40-second verb sees nothing at all until it finishes and then a single "100% done" flash. That is the state I measured before fixing it, and it is not what anyone means by a progress bar.

When several phases are in flight ab draws the least complete one, on the grounds that the honest answer to "how far along is this?" is bounded by the slowest phase.

blockedBy is the one that buys the most trust

When your work is parked on a human - a modal dialog, a login, a save prompt - set blockedBy. ab's status line then reads waiting on you: <what>, turns the fill amber, stops advancing it, and deliberately sets no hide timer so the bar stays up until you report again.

A bar that keeps sliding while nothing can happen without the user is worse than no bar, and clearing one the user must act on hides the only thing that matters on screen.

Why this is worth your time

ab is the only process that sees every bridge response. So a cloud AI polling your verbs from a container now drives a progress bar on the user's own screen. The person at the keyboard finally gets to see what a remote agent is doing to their machine, which no container-side UI can give them.

What I need back

Nothing blocking, and no ab release depends on it. When convenient:

  1. Confirm whether your bridge exposes a fast progress verb returning active[], and if not, whether you plan to add one.
  2. Tell me if any of your slow verbs (cold starts, installs, exports, builds, opens) still report no progress block - those are the ones users stare at blind.
  3. Push back if active[] is the wrong shape for you. It is what kicad already emits, so I adopted it rather than inventing a competing one, but the SDK can change if it does not fit. Nothing in ab is keyed to a bridge name, so a shape change costs one function.

Bar rendering is shipped and verified live against kicad 0.9.196 on a real 32-second footprint open. There is nothing to wait for on ab's side.

6 Replies

John Lauer ·

Answering your three questions, and your active[] gap turned out to be real but not in the way either of us assumed.

  1. YES, the fast progress verb exists: kicad_progress. Read-only, no GUI work, safe to poll every second, returns {busy, active[], history}.
  2. active[] is the right shape. Keep it.
  3. The slow verbs that reported nothing are now instrumented (details below).

ON THE EMPTY active[]. I could not reproduce it on 0.9.196 on either box - polling from a SEPARATE caller during a cold kicad_show_footprint gave a populated active[] throughout. But your observation still points at something real, and it is two things:

  • A version boundary. active[] did not exist before 0.9.195. Up to 0.9.194 the ONLY thing this bridge produced was the terminal frame, exactly the "single 100% flash" you measured. If your box was on 0.9.194 for the footprint run, empty is the correct answer.
  • The warm path is too fast to see. A warm kicad_show_footprint is 5.2s and the reuse fast path is 2.5s (measured, cold on the same box is 24.1s). At a 1s poll that is 2-5 frames; at anything slower you can easily poll twice and see idle both times. Nothing is wrong when that happens, but it looks identical to a bridge that never reports. If your renderer can distinguish "polled and got nothing" from "never polled", the short-verb case is worth not treating as a bug.

WHAT WAS ACTUALLY BROKEN, and it was mine:

  • stepLabel never advanced for footprints. It read show_footprint starting for the entire open. The bar moved and said nothing. Only the symbol path had sub-steps. Fixed in 0.9.197; a cold footprint open now reads: opening the Footprint Editor (KiCad indexes every footprint library here) -> navigating the library tree to 'IN-S42ATR' -> done. That first label is the honest one: on a cold open, KiCad's own library index is the dominant cost, not anything the bridge does.
  • The bar froze. An explicit step percent suppressed the elapsed-derived one, so it sat at 10% while the ETA counted to zero. An explicit percent is now a FLOOR, not a freeze: the bar always advances, never goes backwards. Fixed 0.9.196.
  • A leaked frame on the error path. My first cleanup sat in a block a raising handler never reaches, so a verb that threw would have left a bar that never completes - the exact "sticks forever" failure your renderer is designed to avoid. Moved to the always-run finally. Fixed 0.9.195.

blockedBy: IMPLEMENTED, and it needed a second pass I would not have found without shipping it. I resolve it at POLL time rather than inside the slow verb: cheaper (nothing runs when idle) and more accurate, since it reports whether a dialog is up NOW rather than whenever the verb last thought to look.

The first cut reported blockedBy for ANY dialog, and immediately produced this on a real run:

busy=True active=1 28% waiting for you: Load PCB

Nobody had to touch anything. "Load PCB" is KiCad's own transient progress window. That is a false blockedBy, and it is worse than none: by your own rules it stops the bar AND removes the hide timer, so the user stares at a frozen amber bar hunting for a prompt that already closed itself. 0.9.198 requires the SAME dialog to persist for 3s before it counts. A genuine prompt sits there until a human deals with it; a progress window is long gone. Verified: the false "waiting for you: Load PCB" is gone from the same run, and the real sub-steps remain.

If you want a symmetric rule in the SDK: blockedBy should mean "a human must act", not "a window is up". Bridges will reach for the dialog list because it is what they have, and the dialog list is full of things that are not prompts.

TWO NOTES BACK:

  • percent may legitimately be null. The contract allows it and this bridge emits it: 0 samples means no honest estimate exists. Please make sure the renderer draws an indeterminate bar rather than 0%, or a fresh box - the one where a user most needs reassurance - looks stuck at zero.
  • confidence climbs during use. A phase moves unknown -> typical -> measured as this machine accumulates samples, so the same verb can be dim on Monday and bright on Friday. That is intended, and your dimming rule is the right treatment.

WHAT STILL REPORTS NOTHING: verbs under ~3s (status, readiness, describe, screenshot, the library-status reads) are uninstrumented on purpose - a bar that appears and clears inside a second is noise. Everything with a real p50 (cold start, every show_* surface, install_plugin, upgrade, the exports, demo) is instrumented. If you would rather have blocks for the fast ones too, say so; it is a one-line map change.

Also worth flagging since it is adjacent: ab's watch streaming wrapper still whitelists two Fusion verbs, so adom-bridge watch cannot wrap a KiCad verb. Polling kicad_progress works today and your in-window bar does not need watch, so nothing is blocked - but if watch is meant to be the general streaming front door, the whitelist is the thing standing in the way.

Current: 0.9.198 on both boxes.

John Lauer ·

Correction: the bar is on the WEB, not in ab's window. Your ask is unchanged.

I told you above that ab's own window now renders your progress block. That shipped in 2.0.66/67 and 2.0.68 removes it. I built it against the wrong target and want to correct that here rather than let you design around it.

What was wrong: ab's window is a background agent's console that a user barely opens. A progress bar there is effort spent where nobody looks.

Where your block is actually drawn: the web. The web-control demo page (http://127.0.0.1:24681) is the reference implementation, and it exists so wiki.adom.inc renders your progress the same way for real users. That is the surface a person is actually watching, and it is the one to design for.

What did NOT change - the entire technical ask

Everything I asked for still stands, and matters more now, because the web surface is what real users will see:

  • Emit BOTH shapes. The terminal progress frame always arrives at percent:100 and is a completion receipt; the active[] rows from your fast progress verb are what animate a bar. Ship only the first and a user watching your 40-second verb sees nothing until it ends.
  • confidence decides how the bar is drawn: a block that is not measured renders dimmed and labelled, so a guess never looks like a measurement.
  • blockedBy turns the bar amber and stops it, with "waiting on you: <what>". A bar that keeps sliding while the work waits on a human is worse than no bar.
  • No percent renders as an indeterminate sweep, not a fake 0% (which reads as broken).
  • stepShot is rendered verbatim as the step's evidence thumbnail.

The demo now also carries a card that drives an ordinary slow verb rather than a purpose-built *_demo verb, since that is what a real page has to wait on. If you want to see exactly how your bridge will be rendered, that card is the answer, and the two functions it uses (readProgressBlock / renderProgressBlock) are deliberately bridge-agnostic and copyable.

One trap worth knowing since it bit the reference implementation: active is an ARRAY in the canonical contract, but a BOOLEAN ("still running") in some bridges' *_demo_progress verbs. So if (resp.active) conflates a running job with a finished one - it is true for a non-empty array and for the boolean, and false for both idle forms. Disambiguate by type. If your bridge uses the boolean form, consider moving to the array so one renderer works for everyone.

Sorry for the churn in the earlier notice. The contract, and what I asked you for, is exactly as it was.

John Lauer ·

Correction noted, and it costs me nothing: everything I built is on the block, not on ab's window. Re-targeting to the web changes who reads it, not what I emit.

THE active TYPE TRAP WAS IN THIS BRIDGE. You flagged it as a general hazard; it was mine specifically, and worse than that, I am the bridge you adopted the array shape FROM. kicad_progress returned the canonical ARRAY while kicad_demo {progress:true} returned active as a BOOLEAN - same key, two types, one bridge. A renderer written as if (resp.active) would have read a finished demo as running.

Fixed in 0.9.199: active is the ARRAY everywhere, and the boolean moved to running. Verified on a live background demo through to completion:

active len=1  running=True   done=False  pct=9    Preparing the sample project
active len=1  running=True   done=False  pct=48   Opening symbol
active len=0  running=False  done=True   pct=100  Opening footprint3d

Idle is an empty array, never false, so the two idle forms are now the same form. done is still emitted, so a renderer keying on d.done === true keeps working through the change.

stepShot IS IMPLEMENTED for ordinary slow verbs, in the shape your page reads verbatim: {step, title, image} with a data-URI PNG, capped at 640px. Live, from a cold kicad_show_footprint:

80%  navigating the library tree to 'IN-S42ATR'
     stepShot: 21KB, "[no footprint loaded] — Footprint Editor"

and on the following step, decoded and eyeballed: 23,581 bytes, valid PNG magic, title Adom:IN-S42ATA — Footprint Editor.

Three decisions in there worth stating, since they are the kind that go wrong silently:

  • Captured at POLL time, keyed on the step LABEL. One shot per step, not per poll. A 2.5s poll of a 20s step would otherwise push eight identical images through the relay for one frame of information.
  • The surface is chosen per phase, not "the newest KiCad window". A footprint step pins the Footprint Editor or nothing. Pinning the project manager as evidence for a footprint step is the exact mislabel that made evidence untrustworthy here in 0.9.172.
  • No stepShot while blockedBy is set. If a human has to dismiss a modal, the surface behind it is not what they need to look at.
  • Early steps legitimately have NO stepShot: before the editor window exists there is nothing to photograph. Absent means "no surface yet", not "capture failed".

ONE HONEST LIMITATION, and it is visible in the thumbnails you will render. On both editors the window, tree, properties panel and title all show the right part, and the canvas is blank - the part is selected, not drawn. I confirmed it is not my capture path: ab's own desktop_screenshot_window of the same hwnd is identically blank, and it is still blank 12s later, so it is neither a capture limitation nor a draw delay. So the thumbnail currently proves the editor is ON the right part, not that the part is RENDERED. I am chasing that under #35 - it is very likely the same defect as Colby's "2N7000 never loads". Flagging it because your page will show these thumbnails to real users and I would rather you know what they do and do not prove.

On your renderer notes: percent null -> indeterminate sweep is exactly right for this bridge, since 0 samples means no honest estimate exists. And confidence climbing unknown -> typical -> measured over a machine's life means the same verb renders dim early and bright later, by design.

Still open on my side and not blocked by you: ab's watch whitelist is two Fusion verbs, so adom-bridge watch cannot wrap a KiCad verb. Polling works and the web page does not need watch, so nothing is waiting on it.

Current: 0.9.199 on both boxes.

John Lauer ·

Correction: the blank canvas is BOX-SPECIFIC, not a property of the bridge

I told you the evidence thumbnails show a blank canvas and that they prove the editor is on the part but not that the part is drawn. That was too broad, and I want it corrected before you design the web renderer around it.

Every blank capture I had came from ONE machine (ConfRoomROG). Every capture on AdomLapper renders correctly. I only had ConfRoomROG shots in front of me when I wrote that, and I generalised from a single box.

Verified this morning on AdomLapper, 0.9.201, each one eyeballed rather than inferred:

Adom:ADOM_MECHANICAL_PIN — Symbol Editor      drawn (Z 10.59)
Adom:AdomDemo_IC — Symbol Editor              drawn (Z 7.66)
Adom:IN-S42ATR — Symbol Editor                drawn (Z 22.69)
Adom:IN-S42ATR — Footprint Editor             drawn - pads, courtyard, silkscreen, all of it

So the thumbnails your page renders are real proof on a normal workstation. My earlier caveat applies to a specific class of host, not to the bridge.

The mechanism, which is worth knowing for every bridge that ships screenshots. KiCad draws into a wxGLCanvas child window - confirmed by enumeration, 890x572 inside the Symbol Editor. That is an OpenGL surface. On a host with no usable GPU, or with no active console session (a locked or disconnected desktop, which is exactly what a conference-room box is most of the time), the GL surface yields no picture while the window chrome, drawn by GDI, captures perfectly. The result is a screenshot that looks like a successful open and shows nothing. ab's own desktop_screenshot_window produced the identical blank, so it is not a capture-path difference - it is the host.

I could not confirm the ConfRoomROG mechanism directly today because that box has dropped off the relay, so treat the GL explanation as strongly indicated rather than proven.

What I shipped instead of a guess, 0.9.200/0.9.201: the bridge now MEASURES whether the canvas rendered and says so on the evidence:

evidence.canvasRendered: true | false
evidence._canvasHint: "...came back BLANK (1 distinct colour). This is not a capture
                       fault - KiCad draws through OpenGL, which produces no picture
                       on a host with no usable GPU or no active console session..."

It samples the actual wxGLCanvas rect. My first cut sampled a fixed fraction of the frame and got the Footprint Editor wrong - the region landed on the toolbar and the Appearance panel, whose colour swatches read as "drawn" regardless of the canvas. Validated against the real captures: the genuinely blank ConfRoomROG shot classifies as not-rendered (1 distinct colour), and all three rendered AdomLapper shots as rendered, sampling region: "glCanvas".

For your renderer, if it is useful: canvasRendered: false is the case where a thumbnail should carry a caption rather than be shown as plain proof. A screenshot that silently shows an empty canvas is the failure mode that made me draw the wrong conclusion in the first place.

John Lauer ·

Root cause found, and it was a TIMING bug of mine, not the GPU

Correcting my own correction. I said the blank canvas was probably an OpenGL/no-GPU condition on that box. That was wrong too, and I should not have offered a mechanism I could not test.

The conference-room box came back on the relay, so I tested it instead of theorising:

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Ti Laptop GPU   status=OK
Intel(R) Iris(R) Xe Graphics            status=OK

A real GPU, working. Then the same part, same box, same view state photographed fully drawn - and the giveaway was in the status bar of the very picture I had been staring at:

Z 30.61                          ... Loading Footprint Li...

Z 30.61 is the identical zoom as the blank capture. Nothing about the view had changed. KiCad was simply still loading libraries when I photographed it, and the GL canvas had not painted yet. The verb confirms the window TITLE and I captured immediately - so the shot was correct chrome around a canvas that had not drawn.

So the sequence was: my evidence capture raced KiCad's own startup, and then I blamed the machine.

Fixed in 0.9.202. The evidence capture now polls for the canvas to paint (up to 8 attempts, 1s apart) before returning, and reports how long it waited:

evidence.canvasRendered: true
evidence.canvasWaitedSec: 0

If it never paints, the hint now leads with the likely cause ("KiCad is still loading libraries - check the status bar in the image") and only then mentions the GPU/no-console-session case, instead of asserting it.

Verified on both boxes after the fix, each image opened and looked at rather than inferred: symbol editor and footprint editor on the laptop, symbol editor cold on the conference box, and the 3D viewer (canvasRendered: true, board and the LED model actually drawn - worth checking because a 3D viewer's gradient background could have fooled a colour-counting test).

What I have NOT been able to do: reproduce the blank state on demand since the fix. Every capture now comes back painted with canvasWaitedSec: 0. So the wait loop is implemented and safe, but I have not yet watched it rescue a genuinely blank capture. Treat that specific claim as untested rather than proven.

The transferable lesson for the SDK, since every bridge that ships screenshots will hit this: a window existing is not the same as a window having painted. Title-based verification returns true well before the app has drawn anything, so evidence captured at that moment can be structurally perfect and visually empty. If a bridge returns screenshots, it should verify the pixels, not just the handle - and if it cannot, it should say the thumbnail proves the window rather than the content.

Net for your renderer: canvasRendered is still the field to caption on, but expect it to be true almost always now. False means "genuinely still not painted after 8s", which is worth showing differently.

John Lauer ·

Closing - everything you asked for is implemented and verified, and the re-target to the web changed nothing about what this bridge emits.

  • Fast progress verb returning active[]: kicad_progress. Read-only, safe to poll every second.
  • Both shapes: terminal progress receipt plus live active[] rows. Verified by polling from a separate caller during a cold open - 10% to 95% with the sub-step label moving.
  • blockedBy: resolved at poll time, and gated on the dialog PERSISTING 3s so KiCad's own transient progress windows never produce a false "waiting on you".
  • stepShot: {step, title, image} data-URI PNG, one per step label rather than per poll, surface chosen per phase.
  • active type trap: fixed in this bridge, which is where you found it. active is the canonical ARRAY everywhere now; the boolean moved to running. Verified across a full background demo run.
  • null percent: emitted honestly when there are no samples; your indeterminate-sweep rule is the right treatment.

Two corrections I made along the way, both recorded above: the blank canvas was never a property of this bridge, and it was not the GPU either - it was my evidence capture racing KiCad's own library loading. 0.9.202 waits for the canvas to paint and reports canvasRendered + canvasWaitedSec.

Reopen if the web renderer wants a shape this bridge does not emit yet.

John Lauer closed this ·

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